Rawr4 Public Alpha Released

Topics: Retired
Mar 22, 2010 at 8:52 AM
Edited Mar 22, 2010 at 8:53 AM

We're pleased to announce that, after long last, Rawr3 has entered public beta. You're still welcome to continue using Rawr2, but we urge you to try out Rawr3, and enjoy all the new features and benefits. Rawr3 is a port of Rawr to Silverlight, which means:

  • You can run Rawr3 in your web browser.
  • No need to download or install anything.
  • It runs on Mac OS X (Intel). Welcome to Rawr, Mac users!
  • You can optionally install it locally with 2 clicks from the web version, if you want to have it locally for offline use.
  • Lots more.

So give Rawr3 a try today! Get started at: http://elitistjerks.com/rawr.php

Please remember that it's still a beta, though, so lots of things are likely to be buggy or incomplete!

Mar 22, 2010 at 7:22 PM

Hey! Congrats! You guys have been working really hard on this and I'm glad to see it come to fruition. :)

Being Rawr3, the harbinger of my doom, I tried it with Mono/Moonlight 3 to see what my future holds ...and it actually loads now! There's hope for me, yay! ^^ Looks really nice too. It's not currently usable in Moonlight, but it loads and I can armory the characters I tried.

Would you be interested in an extensive Moonlight support test during this phase of testing, or would you like me to wait until Rawr3 goes stable? Also, I would like to request the WPF version be put up somewhere with a regular link since Moonlight doesn't support the install method Rawr3 tries to call. I'd really like to test it. :)

Mar 22, 2010 at 9:01 PM

Good to hear that the Moonlight people have been busy! Yeah, let us know what's broken, just know that it'll be really low priority for a while. And we'll be releasing the WPF version when Rawr3 gets more stable.

Mar 22, 2010 at 9:31 PM

Been trying this out for most of the day now. I do have a few questions though. Most of which deal with the options menu:

a) What is the difference between a Generic Algorithm and a Simulated Annealing Optimization method?

b) What is the difference in the Proc Effect Calculating Mode?

c) What is the difference in the Effect Combinations Calculation Mode?

d) What does the report from Test Calculation Performance indicate (ran it and got a report of 01:13.090000)

other then that, I do have a few bugs that I'll post in the Issue tracker, though one I'm not sure is a bug or a technical issue. Tried updating Titanstone Pendant tanking neck from Ulduar (was trying to put together a Herald of the Titan bear set) from WoWhead and it came back with a "Failed - [Arg_NullReferenceException]" error in the tooltip.

Mar 22, 2010 at 11:11 PM

I've written a wiki page explaining the available options: http://rawr.codeplex.com/wikipage?title=Options

Mar 22, 2010 at 11:54 PM
Edited Mar 22, 2010 at 11:54 PM

A through C are all referring to things that have existed in Rawr for, well, forever now.  :)  And Kavan has the rundown above.

Mar 23, 2010 at 12:05 AM
Edited Mar 23, 2010 at 12:05 AM

I never noticed them before :( I guess having the options menu more visible perked my curiosity.

Mar 24, 2010 at 2:31 AM

Annoyingly, my browser crashes when I'm running a pre-release Silverlight 4. :(

Mar 24, 2010 at 2:40 AM

Rawr is currently using Silverlight 3, you don't need Silverlight 4.

Mar 24, 2010 at 2:52 AM

Yeah, I was trying it at work, and apparently the build I have isn't backwards compatible or something. Here at home I have SL 3 and it's just fine.

Mar 24, 2010 at 9:30 AM
I'm using SL 3 and Firefox and it still crashed : /
Mar 24, 2010 at 12:47 PM

If Rawr is crashing on you please open an issue with bug report explaining what happened and we'll investigate.

Mar 27, 2010 at 12:57 AM

Is it normal for Rawr 3 beta and Silverlight to comsume >380mg of memory?

Mar 27, 2010 at 1:50 AM

Depends on the model but I'd say it's normal.

Mar 27, 2010 at 9:29 AM

Silverlight refuses to install on my machine :(

Mar 27, 2010 at 10:12 AM

That sucks?


You'll have to give quite a bit more detail than that, if you want any help.

Mar 27, 2010 at 10:20 AM

Sorry, was just a passing comment :)


I have downloaded silverlight 3 times now, I run the install with nothing else open, I get installation failed, the more information link sends me to a non existant microsoft page. http://www.microsoft.com/getsilverlight/resources/help.aspx?errorID=1635



Mar 27, 2010 at 10:41 AM

Check Add/Remove programs, see if there's any copies of Silverlight installed; uninstall them. Then goto silverlight.net, and download and install Silverlight 3 (not 2, not 4, must be 3).

Mar 27, 2010 at 10:48 AM

No copies of silverlight installed at all.

Is there any other M$ product needs installing first ?





Mar 27, 2010 at 11:28 AM

Nope, just need to meet the system requirements listed at http://www.microsoft.com/getsilverlight/get-started/install/default.aspx, ie use Windows XP+, or Mac OSX Intel, and a popular browser.

Mar 28, 2010 at 8:09 PM

>net helpmsg 1635

"This patch package could not be opened.  Verify that the patch package exists and that you can access it, or contact the application vendor to verify that this is a valid Windows Installer patch package."

Try clearing your browser cache and then downloading it again.

Possibly could be: http://forums.silverlight.net/forums/p/83560/195607.aspx




Mar 28, 2010 at 8:41 PM

Something funny is going on with the miss calculation. After optimizing my TankDK, the "changes" sheet is showing that I went from 3% miss to something like 19%. This is after optimizing for more hit. Either the calculation is way off or Rawr's mixing up "miss" and "target miss" [which, by the way, could be worded a little better, target miss has nothing to do with the target missing, but I'm assuming this is limited to the TankDK module]

Another note about TankDK, for some reason it's also insisting that I wear my DPS set's boots over tank ones, which is absurd.

Tank - http://www.wowhead.com/?item=46997
DPS - http://www.wowhead.com/?item=50788

Either it's weighting Expertise way too heavily (I'm already around 36 Exp) or it's disregarding the strength gems I have forced onto the DPS boots.

By the way, what happened to Cost? Does it not take set bonuses into account anymore? If I optimize with 400 badges [enough to buy 4pc t10 and then some], it still prefers to take the 264 non-tier stuff. Perhaps the stats from 264 pieces are more valuable than 4pc set bonuses [doubt it], but then it doesn't recognize that the tier is upgradeable either? Is there a way to implement that?

Speaking of Cost, why was the Triumph option removed? It's still the base badge, and any toon gearing up [aka those not yet 11/12 ICC aka those with enough gear options to benefit from using Rawr regularly] would probably still like a Triumph cost option, no?

It's as simple as putting "Load Emblem of Triumph" back in there, but it would really shine if there were a way to use both at once. Say you have 100T and 60F, it could optimize for the best usage of the combination.

Mar 28, 2010 at 10:14 PM

Please repost that in appropriate threads, and/or issues.

Mar 30, 2010 at 1:37 PM

I am behind a firewall at work that is very picky.

I'm not able to get to Elitist Jerks, so I was wondering if you guys planned to have a link here on Codeplex to download Rawr3 for local use.

If not, I guess my days of slacking off at work are over. :-(


Mar 30, 2010 at 3:25 PM

If not: Download the sourcecode. Get a copy of Visual C# Express (www.msdn.com). Compile your own.

You don't need to be a programmer to do this.  just open the solution, select 'release' and hit the build button.

Mar 30, 2010 at 5:26 PM

It'll be hosted within rawr.codeplex.com, eventually.

Apr 2, 2010 at 12:11 AM
OReubens wrote:

If not: Download the sourcecode. Get a copy of Visual C# Express (www.msdn.com). Compile your own.

You don't need to be a programmer to do this.  just open the solution, select 'release' and hit the build button.

It makes me feel like a programmer to be able to do this much.  Don't shatter my delusions!  :P

May 18, 2010 at 2:03 PM

As a precautionary announcement, if you are currently having issues loading your characters into RAWR 3, it's because Elitist Armory which is the go-between site for the Armory was just MMO-Championed and most of the pages are unavailable at this time. Once EA is able to fix the overload issues, then RAWR 3 should be working again.

Jun 18, 2010 at 9:47 AM

whenever i try to open my lock i get

Debugging resource strings are unavailable. Often the key and arguments provide sufficient information to diagnose the problem. See http://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?linkid=106663&Version=4.0.50524.0&File=mscorlib.dll&Key=Arg_IndexOutOfRangeException

   at Rawr.Warlock.CalculationOptionsWarlock.GetBaseHitRate()
   at Rawr.Warlock.CharacterCalculationsWarlock..ctor(Character character, Stats stats)
   at Rawr.Warlock.CalculationsWarlock.GetCharacterCalculations(Character character, Item additionalItem, Boolean referenceCalculation, Boolean significantChange, Boolean needsDisplayCalculations)
   at Rawr.Calculations.GetCharacterCalculations(Character character, Item additionalItem, Boolean referenceCalculation, Boolean significantChange, Boolean needsDisplayCalculations)
   at Rawr.UI.MainPage.character_CalculationsInvalidated(Object sender, EventArgs e)
   at Rawr.UI.MainPage.set_Character(Character value)
   at Rawr.UI.MainPage.armoryLoad_Closed(Object sender, EventArgs e)
   at System.Windows.Controls.ChildWindow.OnClosed(EventArgs e)
   at System.Windows.Controls.ChildWindow.Close()
   at System.Windows.Controls.ChildWindow.set_DialogResult(Nullable`1 value)
   at Rawr.UI.ArmoryLoadDialog._armoryService_GetCharacterCompleted(Object sender, EventArgs`1 e)
   at Rawr.ElitistArmoryService.bwParseCharacter_RunWorkerCompleted(Object sender, RunWorkerCompletedEventArgs e)
   at System.ComponentModel.BackgroundWorker.OnRunWorkerCompleted(RunWorkerCompletedEventArgs e)
   at System.ComponentModel.BackgroundWorker.<OnRun>b__1(Object state)

I do not experience any problems while loading my other chars though

Jun 18, 2010 at 10:17 AM


Search for existing issues before posting, please.

Jun 19, 2010 at 6:21 AM
Edited Jun 19, 2010 at 6:21 AM

Also, bug reports, even for Rawr3, STILL go in the Issue Tracker, NOT in Discussions.

Jun 22, 2010 at 1:22 PM

What is the current beta release version of rawr3 as mine currently says it is b7

Jun 22, 2010 at 3:48 PM

Currently, b7.

In about an hour, hopefully, b8.

Jun 22, 2010 at 4:04 PM
Edited Jun 22, 2010 at 4:06 PM
Astrylian wrote:

Currently, b7.

In about an hour, hopefully, b8.

 thanks Astryian I'm guessing 2.3.19 won't be far behind either :p

Might be an idea to post on the Rawr3 page what the most upto date version number is, as I had to recache my offline version as it was stuck at b5 for ages

Jun 22, 2010 at 4:55 PM

Do the two versions typically match up? In other words, the version of Rawr3 the same as Rawr2? Or does one receive updates more regularly.

Jun 22, 2010 at 4:57 PM
We try to keep each one as up-to-date as the other. Unfortunately b8 did not get released when 2.3.18, so b7 is still running 2.3.17's build.
Jun 22, 2010 at 6:27 PM
Actually the online version is more like the 2.3.15 build, but Astry is bringing both Rawr2 and Rawr3 up to 2.3.19 right now.
Jun 22, 2010 at 7:59 PM

I try to keep them in sync, but the last couple Rawr2 builds have come at a time when there happen to have been some Rawr3 compile issues. 

I wasn't able to release Rawr3 before I left for work today, just Rawr2. Why? It's Gwin's fault. I'll get Rawr3 up when I get home. Preferably before raid. 

Jul 1, 2010 at 4:52 AM

Out of curiosity how long do you intend to maintain Rawr 2 for? I'm guessing sooner or later you'll dump it and just focus on Rawr 3?

Jul 1, 2010 at 5:22 AM

Yeah, sooner or later. We're still way behind where I'd like to be as far as feature parity on them.

Jul 5, 2010 at 10:26 AM

So I'm going to take a guess that Rawr will never work on a Power PC Mac.

Jul 5, 2010 at 4:24 PM

Well, you can try to use Mono, however... It's time for you to upgrade, buddy.

Jul 5, 2010 at 6:29 PM

I've tried Mono. No go. G5 Dual 1.8 Ghz Processor, 4 gigs of ram. Don't really need an upgrade. Oh well...

Jul 5, 2010 at 7:25 PM
Which version of Mono?
Jul 5, 2010 at 7:42 PM

Unless you're using it for very specialized work (ie, sound engineering), you need an upgrade. If that's what you're using it for, you need a new machine to do everything else on. Sorry, let the PPC go, it's time.

Jul 16, 2010 at 6:02 AM

I was using the most recent version of Mono

I just got the G5 tower. Upgrade from my G4 iBook. No way I'm lettin' it go. I'll just have to survive without Rawr, or find a monitor for one of the countless trash PCs I have in the basement.

Jul 16, 2010 at 7:47 AM

Mono 2.4 doesn't work for it, but Mono 2.2 does.  As far as I understand it.  (Macs are the devil's spawn, as far as I'm concerned.  :P)

Jul 16, 2010 at 7:47 PM

Mono 2.6 also works fine.

Jul 20, 2010 at 4:57 PM

so im using a mac, i downloaded silverlink from the EJ page, now what? im sorry i really do suck with computers, but would like to run rawr on my mac. Ive been using it on my laptop for awhile now but its so damn slow.

Jul 20, 2010 at 5:30 PM

Yeah... Sounds like you may want to stick with what you're already comfortable, if you can't figure out stuff like this (and I don't mean that in a rude way).

No idea what your problem could be, based on what you told us.

Nov 7, 2010 at 2:04 PM
  • No need to download or install anything.

So give Rawr3 a try today! Get started at: http://elitistjerks.com/rawr.php


Is this a joke? As soon as I click the link i read  "YOU NEED TO INSTALL blablabla"


Nov 7, 2010 at 2:06 PM

You must have SIlverlight installed to run a SIlverlight Web Application.  However, if your up to date on your windows updates, Silverlight 4 is part of Windows Update.

Nov 19, 2010 at 3:53 AM
Edited Nov 19, 2010 at 4:10 AM

Hi there.

I sorry first if it's not the place for this...
I'm actually using the rawr beta at http://elitistjerks.com/rawr.php and encounter one issue while trying to load my avi from armory...
Here a pic of what I encounter. The "à" on the pic mean "at"... sorry for that, I'm french...
So, I searched a bit, and found out that http://elitistarmory.com/ was taken down...

First of all, does http://elitistjerks.com/rawr.php is still the good link for rawr3?!

If yes, how can I load my avi without http://elitistarmory.com/ or have to do all myself?!


Thanks is advance, Tsuki.

Nov 19, 2010 at 4:21 AM

No, Rawr does not work right now, we're preparing it for Cata.

Nov 19, 2010 at 4:40 AM

Oh.. I see... Quite bad though...

I'm bored of my loosy dps with my enhance shaman...
I was thinking about looking whats wrong with rawr's help...

Nov 19, 2010 at 6:06 AM
Tsukiumi wrote:

I'm bored of my loosy dps with my enhance shaman...

I was thinking about looking whats wrong with rawr's help...

For the time being, give Enhsim a go for your Enh Shaman problems.  It is currently up to date for lvl 80 stuff.

Nov 19, 2010 at 4:54 PM

Well, there still have some bugs, it doesn't count the expertise from my spec... :(

Nov 20, 2010 at 2:01 PM

Then... just don't use any outside tool for the whole two weeks we have left of the expansion?  Seriously, coming from a group of min-maxers, hardcore raiders, and mathheads: Absolute optimization is useless right now.

Nov 22, 2010 at 2:33 AM
Tsukiumi wrote:

Well, there still have some bugs, it doesn't count the expertise from my spec... :(

Not really the place for this (goto: http://enhsim.codeplex.com), but that is because the expertise from Unleashed Rage is included in your paper doll stats.  Or, for a more in depth explanation, read the elitist jerks thread on EnhSim.  Seriously, read it.

Other than that, totally agree with BrWarner.  Don't worry about min/maxing until cata hits.

Dec 3, 2010 at 4:27 PM
Edited Dec 3, 2010 at 4:28 PM

Is this some kind of joke?

I mean, to call this beta....

This is not even freaken alpha yet!

First and formost, there is NO way to load my hunter charector.

I get error messages all over the place even loading this dam app.

Then there is so my NYI (I assume Not yet installed or included)

I cant even manually enter my own gear, gems, chants, talent points... etc.

Every single thing I have tried has ended with error after error.


I know I didn't pay jack for this, however, dont be so dam rushed to put something out and call it "beta" with some bugs.


IMO this is crap!

(By the way, no I will not be submitting bug reports, your not even to the stage yet.)

(I have tried this on firefox, IE 8, and Chrome)

I have tried this with Silverlight 3 and 4

So I am thinking pretty much this is not on my end.

Dec 3, 2010 at 4:35 PM

I don't even know what to say to that, I can't stop laughing.

Dec 3, 2010 at 5:34 PM

1) We know the posted version doesn't work, and we've said that, several times. It was only posted to show the updated talent talents trees really, most of the models won't load correctly because well... they weren't written for Cataclysm yet.

2) We'd rather have an OBVIOUSLY broken Rawr4 version up, than to have people load characters into Rawr3 and think that the numbers are somehow valid.

3) Character is spelled c-h-a-r-a-c-t-e-r not "charector". Based on your syntax, it looks like English isn't your first language. If it isn't so be it, you probably did your best.

4) Did you read the thread? If you did you'd see we've stated repeatedly how pointless it is to min/max your DPS until you hit 85. Until then, you should be focused on leveling your character as nothing else matters.

Dec 3, 2010 at 5:44 PM
Edited Dec 3, 2010 at 5:45 PM

1. "We know the posted version doesn't work, and we've said that, several times. It was only posted to show the updated talent talents trees really, most of the models won't load correctly because well... they weren't written for Cataclysm yet."

Well then I guess it is a little misleading to have: Rawr3 Public Beta has been released! as your tag line on everything, and maybe something more along the lines of PREVIEW

2. "We'd rather have an OBVIOUSLY broken Rawr4 version up, than to have people load characters into Rawr3 and think that the numbers are somehow valid."

See the answer to my last item

3. Character is spelled c-h-a-r-a-c-t-e-r not "charector". Based on your syntax, it looks like English isn't your first language. If it isn't so be it, you probably did your best.

Attacking my spelling is really the big issue here? It seems to me a little on the defensive end, instead of an apoligy that you OBVIOUSLY rushed an item, and now say in the forums WE KNOW IT IS BROKEN, how about the change to preview or alpha? Or take it off the freaken PUBLIC BETA list.

4. The point of Rawr (at least why I always used it) was to see in some theroy on how changes would effect me. I am not looking for Max DPS, no matter how good my gear, gems, chants, glyphs are... it still comes down to a lot of other factors such as shot roatation, making sure the right shots or casts are up at the right time, when to use CD's etc.

Now my two cents (Again), yes I know my spelling sucks, I imagine you are one of those who troll trade chat correcting other people's spelling and grammer with a sense of self entilement or some personal satisfaction of having a better spelling / vocabulary that the next guy. Regaurdless of what my first language is, and yes it is english, how about addressing my orginal and again repeated requests to take this off of public beta and list it as what it is, a good alpha or preview version.

Dec 3, 2010 at 5:54 PM
Edited Dec 3, 2010 at 5:55 PM

Try bothering to look at the date the first post was made. Yes that's right back in March. Back then it worked guess what Blizzard redid everything since then not least of which was complete revamp of the talent trees to 31 points.


So instead of screaming at us to get it right for a FREE piece of software that you have not contributed ANYTHING towards, why don't you just delete your account and stop posting. All you are doing is making it more likely we will add specific code so that it never again works for your characters.

A screaming child that says give me, give me, give me is more likely to get a slap than what they want.

Dec 3, 2010 at 6:05 PM

OK have it your way.

Great way to promote your product.

If your so entitled to push off on people that we dont pay for open source programs, I suggest you take it off the open source market.

Also you may notice that I am using an account I made fresh today, as in I am not posting on my regular account,S

So in closing, I will close my account,

and remove my support for you on my websites as well


Best of luck in your furture endevors...

Dec 3, 2010 at 6:18 PM

Dude... seriously... Look at all the Rawr4 threads that were spawned after this one:

Various Rawr 4 status updates and such. NUMEROUS other threads talking about Cata and WoW 4.x and Rawr 4.x.

The idea that we're not being clear at this point is ludicrous.

Dec 3, 2010 at 6:26 PM

OK, 1, I digress (I can do that you know, as you could to, if you got off your mountain tops). I screwed up.

I came to the site today, seeing the BIG FREAKING BOLD LETTERS saying Rawr 3 Public released, and thought you finally had a beta out!

I screwed up thinking that you finally had a working product.

However, you guys are complete assholes.

I will not use rawr again.

In the future, some poeple dont wade through 500+ pages of forums (I dont know your number I just made one up), to see the status of a program, they download (or in this case click on the link) and expect it to work.


Here is an idea, why dont you change your main page.

Anyways, I found a program that works, I would not be surprised if this post is removed for telling others about it, it is called FemaleDwarf.com

Again. I am done with you eltist asshats.

Dec 3, 2010 at 6:34 PM
Edited Dec 3, 2010 at 6:35 PM

Hey basicphreak. I'm Astrylian, the leader of the Rawr project. You're a socially inept, retarded asshole. Nice to meet you. Don't let the door hit you on the way out.

Dec 3, 2010 at 8:35 PM
Edited Dec 3, 2010 at 8:38 PM

Thread renamed to Rawr4 Public Alpha for the time being. The link at the top of Discussions and the Main Page have also been updated to that name.

For everyone that is not socially retarded:

Rawr4 is currently posted in a very early ALPHA state. The BETA release will come in about a week (which is just a couple of days after Cataclysm's release). When we are reasonably certain that the initial kinks are worked out of the builds, we will change the release to a regular non-beta release.

Remember, at any time if you have the tools to do so, you can build your own local copy of the latest Rawr4 build on the TFS/SVN Server to see how we are progressing.

Dec 4, 2010 at 1:19 PM

Do you want test results of the Rawr4 Alpha entered into the Issue tracker, or should I wait till you posted 

a Beta version before entering any Issues I notice?


Thanks for the great work!


Steffen Haeuser


Dec 4, 2010 at 3:47 PM

Oh hey! I love Rawr. It's a very nice thing. And I am excited for beta. 

That is all <3

Dec 4, 2010 at 5:09 PM

Start reporting issues with the Beta, please, which should be in the next few days.

Dec 5, 2010 at 10:37 PM

I very strongly think this thread should be closed an a new one linked. Its going to cause lots of issues if users click on Rawr 4 alpha available and the first post is March 2010 talking about Rawr 3 beta. A fresh thread is probably better isn't it?

Dec 5, 2010 at 11:05 PM

ummm ya, more on that shortly

Dec 6, 2010 at 11:50 AM

I remember the plan was to keep the "Dowloaded Version" as well as the "Browser Version" 

Is this still the case ? 

P.S. thank you for this awesome program that i used for so long and will keep using (as long as i can download it) <3

Dec 6, 2010 at 11:54 AM

Download version is still planned, but it's not ready yet.

Dec 6, 2010 at 3:59 PM

This thread has been retired, please post to http://rawr.codeplex.com/Thread/View.aspx?ThreadId=237262